Hash oil e-cig juice

Discussion in 'Concentrate Tools' started by D34D_1C3, Jan 25, 2011.

  1. Thanks windowless :) I think I've been too vague still, so I'm going to try and elaborate a bit step-by-step.

    Ok, you do NOT want to use all that plant matter, because you will be drawing plant waxes, chlorophyll and other unnecessary agents into your resulting tincture, taking up room, reducing 'storage space' for the potency you actually desire to be held within your tincture. Also, this will burn out your atomizers at a much faster, almost immediate, rate.

    You do NOT want to use acetone. Although it's generally considered safe and acceptable to add in minuscule quantities in the US food industry (bleck), you still never want to add acetone to something you'll be eating, but you especially should NEVER add it to something you'll be inhaling.

    The lungs are far more susceptible to the trademark damage that acetone is known for. People use it for chemical peels, in smaller quantities than we're discussing... not something you want to expose your delicate lungs to.

    Activation is only required when you'll be consuming your medication orally or sublingually. This is what the acetone would have done anyhow, had I recommended you used it. Activation can occur with alcohol, glycerin, heat, and by simply over-drying your material before use. It's known as decarboxylation, or decarbing. Alcohol will, over a period of time, dry the herb out from within removing the carboxyl group, carbon dioxide, water etc. Glycerin does the same, when it's not already water-logged. Some people use food dehydrators. Others, use the oven and some foil, or oven bags.

    Traditionally, glycerin hash 'e-liquid' is thought to be primed for vaporization when sublingual (under the tongue) effects are nearing their peak.

    E-cig atomizers however reach temperatures of roughly 250 degrees, and like smoking or any other form of vaporization, activation takes place additionally as the product is used.

    Adding alcohol to PG is not necessary but can be done with one or two drops per liquid oz PG, if you were using glycerin I would recommend adding roughly 7 - 10 drops of grain alcohol, per liquid oz of glycerin tincture.

    If you attempt to make this the way you were planning from the start, you will end up with a product that is absolutely too weak for e-cig use (requiring cart, after cart, after cart, to achieve any amount of effect), and the flavor upon vaporization will be abysmal. If it's not too foul however, you'd still be able to eat it.
    I'm not trying to come down on you, and I always encourage any and all forms of safe experimentation, I am speaking from decades of experience with what you're about to try.

    It should taste like a creamy caramel candy, when vaped. Will (the fellow, who has a very good thread on herb-glycerin tincture) has used my method in his Volcano, and agrees that it is a lovely way to use a glycerin tincture.
     
  2. Yeah I know the NJoy's suck but hey, I got it for free lol. My thing is the taste of PG. As BadKitty stated, it reminds me of fun-house fog fluid. Because it is.

    I used to run the fog machine for my church band (back when I believed lol) and we just filled it full of these big generic white jugs of PG. That sweet taste makes me gag and I don't think any brand can cover that up. It's like spraying cologne on cat piss: you'll always smell it, but now it's got cologne on it.

    But yeah, sorry to offend any ecig users with myy generalization, but that's just been my experience.

    As for the tincture in the ecig, that's badass. Now let's start another project: grain alc in an asthma inhaler.
     
  3. I completely understand where you're coming from now, it does make sense. If you're exposed to that much of it in a different environment you're going to find it less palatable in the future, for a lot of people the smell and taste is probably much less familiar and more 'new' so, combined with other flavors, they can ignore the fun house PG, especially those who've never been around fog machines.

    You could probably try a glycerin tincture, but I bet you'll still feel that its taste is a bit too close to the PG. In your situation I think you would enjoy a discreet portable vaporizer for pure herb, or tobacco if you were attempting to quit analog cigarettes. If the herb is particularly good and has a potent smell, you can still disguise the odor when vaping by making a 'shisha' (look up hookah shisha recipes, good for vaping and proper hookah use; not combustion) by adding flavored glycerin tincture to your herb, before public vaporization.
    Coating ground herb intended for vaporization can add extra potency and kick, and a fruity or savory odor that compliments and disguises the canna, without completely overwhelming you with glycerin flavor as an e-cig may do.

    They aren't my primary vape... to be honest, usually I use bongs :) I use e-cigs because I can vape in shops, malls, clubs, restaurants, theatres, and all other venues where vaporizing is accepted or not questioned, but smoking may be prohibited.
     
  4. #25 Mr. Mojorising, Jan 26, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 26, 2011
  5. You may be right. Even back then that smell/taste nauseated me. I guess it's generally just not for everyone.

    I understand. I NEVER smoke/vape in public tho so I it's not been a huge concern. Not even in my car. I AM Paranoid Parrot so I just save it till I'm in the comfort of my home :eek:
     
  6. Here is a write up on a recent study done by US docs.

    DailyTech - Study: E-Cigarettes Fail at Nicotine Delivery, No Better Than Unlit Cigarette

    I did not stop using them because of any such study. I stopped using them because unless I puffed on them constantly all day, they did absolutely nothing to curb my cravings. As soon as I tried Swedish SNUS, my cravings were gone. I have found nothing that even compares to the nicotine delivery of swedish snus. The closest thing to a big red easy button I have found to quit smoking, and I have tried everything out there.
     
  7. Thanks guys, at the very least you have convinced me to use iso instead of acetone, as far as the thc source goes, i am still going to be using the vaped bud i have just for convenience and to save money. If it works, i'll probably upgrade to fresh bud, but i'm not willing to risk wasting that for a test.

    also, Strangely enough i enjoy the taste of PG, not sure why but have always liked it both in e-cigs and in giant fog filled rooms lol.
     
  8. #29 BadKittySmiles, Jan 27, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 27, 2011
    The validity of a study, done by a community/public research college that receives state financial aid from the tobacco industry (ie, the people responsible for analog cigarettes, not nicotine and tobacco in and of itself) is questionable, at best. In the dozens of other studies performed by outside institutes, they found nothing suspicious about the nicotine levels, they focus more closely on other possible dangers as well as benefits.
    Odds are you were hoping for more of a sensation of burning plant matter and smoking, and were disappointed with the reality of liquid vaporization.

    Google 'nicotine poisoning (or) overdose' and 'e-cigs'.. there are many more incidents of nicotine over dose due to electronic cigarettes, than there are studies purporting a lack of nicotine delivery. Like I said earlier, it doesn't remain in the cartridge, so it's certainly ending up someplace (likely, in the jittery lungs of the user).

    Like many of the people who commented in that article noticed, there is a distinct and definite difference in the nicotine levels from 0mg, to 18mg, to 24mg carts, and it is very characteristically nicotine. I personally don't use tobacco, haven't since I was a kid, but I have accidentally used liquid with nicotine, and I can tell you from experience that if you have a decent quality liquid, there is absolutely nicotine being delivered into your system.

    People have been admitted to hospital and have tested positive for nicotine poisoning from e-cigs, and from using analogs in conjunction with e-cigs, due simply to the fact they don't realize they need fewer puffs with an e-cig versus an analog.
    These are people who feel 'it's not working' for them, because they are addicted to the sensation of burning material as well, and they vape, and vape, and vape, looking for that feeling, until they become ill and OD.

    The nicotine level present in each individual bottle doesn't always correlate exactly to the amount suggested on the label... but the same goes for analog cigarettes. It's a well known inconsistency that conveniently provides variety, and keeps people hooked.
     
  9. Well first, this is not the post to discuss this, we are totally hijacking the thread. Whether questionable or not, the study exists, the study concludes they are a lousy nicotine delivery device, to which I agree from personal experience, and I was asked to post a link so I did. I am not against the e-cig. Whether it delivers nicotine or not, if it helps people stop smoking, then I am all for it. It did nothing for me. I puffed all day long on 36 mg juice and still craved nicotine very badly. I pop a SNUS in, and no craving. Thats all the proof I need. There are also no long term studies yet on the e-cigs, so I am reluctant to call them safe. But safer than cigs, I am prone to agree.

    But anyway, I will stop here as this is a discussion for another thread.
     
  10. The study doesn't indicate what brands they tested, what models, what liquids... they could come up with whatever results they liked, if they based their study around the lesser, cheaper no-name brands, and worse, knock-offs. I'm not going to sit here and give out the dozens of other studies that say different, we can all use google, but glossing over them for a single biased, information-less study, performed by a college in a state that produces huge volumes of analog cigarette tobacco, that says otherwise, does even less.

    There are people who suffer severe nicotine poisonings due to e-cig use, taking that very real danger into consideration, it's completely irresponsible to claim they don't deliver nicotine to the system which is why for members safety I feel obligated to say otherwise, and to mention that it is a big problem that many physicians had with those early, biased studies, that people felt e-cigs were more tame than they are, and very many users experience minor to severe overdose with their trial kits. The ease and speed of the proven nicotine delivery, is one of the arguments anti e-cig movements have used against them.
     
  11. #32 BadAxe, Jan 27, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 27, 2011
    They do not deliver nicotine. I am walking proof, as well as the studies results. Refute it as you see fit. Thats whats wrong with the internet. You can't win even with scientific studies. I can do the same to the studies that say it does deliver nicotine. But I won't. Because I said I am not against them. I am all for the people that they help with mentally, they just do not deliver nicotine. Not in a usable way that the body gets satisfied with. If it delivers it to them in ways that can make them sick, well, thats not what we are looking for. We are looking for a delivery of nicotine that satisfies, and the e-cig does not, and has been proven to not do so. But since this is the internet, then the study was biased, but yours that prove your points are not. I get how it works. And I will also say that any reports that point to the safety of e-cigs are a joke. The product is what, 5 years old? There are zero long term studies to date on them. But that doesn't matter, cause the good reports are fact, and unrefutable. But anything negative, well, its biased.

    But since the internet proves everyone right, and allows those same to refute studies based on what they want to prove, you win. I surrender. Keep spreading the false word that these things are safe, because we know that, at least on the internet its proven and can't be unproven, and that they deliver nicotine in satisfying levels even though its proven it does not, but can be internet refuted, because thats the power of the internet.

    The only people I have ever seen the e-cig help with are people that need the hand to mouth action. Have never had anyone tell me they are satisfied smoking one. Also, browse the e-cig boards, most of thel oyal users also use snus / chew/dip and or nasal snuff as supplements. Those e-cigs are sure delivering a lot of nicotine when users need all of those other supplements. Argue as much as you want, the e-cig is a non nicotine delivery device. Period. The same people that say they are satisfied with the nic delivery of an e-cig, could be given a no nicotine cart, and they would tell you how much of they are enjoying the nicotine satisfaction. That says enough right there. I have been around these things since their beginning. They are a money sink and mostly a waste of time, unless it helps people with the mental aspect. The mental game is a pretty strong one, as you can see for yourself, since you have fooled yourself into thinking they deliver nicotine. So for people like you, they are absolutely perfect, and why I am glad to see them on the market. Even if you never see the reality, if they help you quit, then they are useful.
     
  12. #33 BadKittySmiles, Jan 27, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 27, 2011


    Believe what you want :)

    But for safety purposes, I need to reiterate they absolutely DO deliver nicotine, and nicotine can absolutely be carried in a vapor: Internet 'mysteries' aside, to test this for yourself, you can put liquid nicotine in one container, apply heat, and transfer it via vapor alone, to another location, and it can be delivered to the body this way in dangerous quantities, proof being those who have been hospitalized due to nicotine poisoning from e-cig use, alone. Bottles of e-liquid containing nicotine are ILLEGAL in Australia and other countries, due to the proven effectiveness in nicotine delivery, because they feel adding high quantities of such readily available nicotine to the problem would make matters worse, as far as quitting goes.
    Liquid nicotine is so readily available to the body, that you can overdose from small quantities dripped topically onto the skin, anywhere on the body. In it's purest form, it takes less than a drop.

    All e-cig 'hoop-la' aside, that it would even be a question whether or not it can be delivered to the lungs in a vapor, or whether it is absorbed once it arrives there, is absurd, knowing the factual, long-standing hard information that we do have on nicotine. There is no reason to doubt it should work, and work well. But I do wonder why a university, funded by huge analog (traditional paper-wrapped) cigarette producers, would want consumers to think it's a less effective method... I do wonder.

    There are other addictive additives in cigarette tobacco. If you don't "get what you need" from e-cigs, odds are your addiction stems from more than nicotine. That's all :)

    edit - I apologize to the OP for digressing so far from his original topic. I've been moderating canna as well as mainstream forums for well over a decade, it's in my nature to ensure the safety of those I work closely with in these mediums.
     
  13. [/quote]



    So what you're saying is,

    they did curb your cravings if you used them often enough?
    and if you used them less often, i.e. not "puffed on them constantly", then you had cravings?

    But they weren't delivering any nicotine to you at all. :laughing:


    That story was a good laugh, tahnks. :smoke:

    thanks dude
     
  14. Just to keep you guys updated so the thread doesn't die, i went to walgreens yesterday and had them order me some 99% pure iso and it should be in by friday, so i will probably run a small batch with what i have over the weekend and see what i get as far as oil goes. If it all works out, i'll order some vegetable glycerine as soon as i have usable oil and go from there. Pics will be posted as soon as i begin the oil extraction.
     
  15. #36 BadAxe, Jan 29, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 29, 2011
    Thats exactly what I am saying. How can you doubt the lack of nicotine delivery if it takes constantl all day puffing to get relief. I am talking constant, all day long. And if anything other than that, there was no satisfiaction. You calling that nicotine delivery? Your attempt at intelligence was an even better laugh, thanks.

    I gotta tell you, I find the e-cig fans are some of the most defensive people i have ever met. They are so fooled mentally, that you can not say a bad word about this totally unstudied device or they will just scream at the top of their lungs how wrong you are and how safe they are, when no one knows shit except the few studies that have been done. I am not even against them, because I love the mental aspect it helps with, which is huge when quitting smoking. They just don't do jack for nicotine delivery. Its scientifically proven, so as many of you as would like can object. Science doesn't try to please people, they report their findings and move on.

    But back to this reply. Yea, if you think puffing on an e-cig constantly for 8 hours to get any relief is nicotine delivery, well then, you should come back to this thread in 10 years or so when you are an adult and can rationalize things properly. But thanks for the entertainment, and your attempt at humiliated me, even with the huge FAIL. Peace.

    I smoked 2 packs a day for over 20 years. I am not a non smoker that doesn't know what he is talking about. I am someone who tried every product on the market to quit. I am someone who was so excited to get my hands on the e-cig. And everytime it failed to deliver, I took others adivce, ordered different models, ordered different juices, different strengths. They all did the same thing. NOTHING. I have 8 models of e-cigs, 25 bottles of juice, batteries, USB batteries, USB power pack, I have it all. Total money sink, total waste of time, UNLESS it helps you with the mental hand to mouth addiction. Or if you are brainwashed easily, as most of the sheep in the US are, then you can also be easily fooled into thinking you are getting nicotine. In that case, they are awesome, because you might actually quit smoking, which is a great thing. E-cigs are a great device for the mental side of smoking. SNUS is a great product for actual nicotine delivery. I got over the mental aspect easily. But for the nicotine cravings, well, only SNUS delivers for me. And for everyone else I have ever known that has used the e-cig. And I know of no e-cig users that still use it, that don't also use other nicotine supplements, which tells you all you need to know about the Nicotine delivery of the e-cig. With snus, I need no supplements. With the e-cig, p0eope need dip/chew. snuff, snus, etc.... Its kind of plain as day, if you can see past the brainwashing. But most sheep can't.
     
  16. Dude, chill. If anyone's being defensive, it's you. You're literally the one person out of hundreds that I've ever met who complains and claims he can't get a nic buzz from e-cigs.

    E-liquids containing nicotine are ILLEGAL in some countries, such as Australia, due to the simple fact they've been tested extensively by their governments (not by a little school, that gets funding from the tobacco industry, like your test) and they were found to deliver -more- nicotine than an average cigarette, and they determined it would only add to the problem of nicotine addiction.

    It's obscene, sickening and very dangerous, that you would tell people they can puff 'all day' without suffering serious and severe consequences. People have been hospitalized for less with e-cig use. They are meant for relaxed use, not constant all-day puffing.

    So brag all you want about how much nicotine you need, and how it's only satisfying if it is all delivered in one nasty go, SNUS is disgusting and it's also dangerous for that very reason, not to mention that -it's tobacco, and it contains additional chemicals both from the tobacco plants as well as 'processing' that you are addicted to, which are also present in analog cigarettes, but NOT in e-liquid for e-cigs-. Bragging is all that amounts to if you focus on just nicotine, and not the literally hundreds of other chemicals you're actually addicted to and finding in your Snus, because for thousands of others e-cigs deliver specifically nicotine, quite satisfactorily. :)
     
  17. I should add that I do not smoke nicotine, and haven't since I was a child except for the occasional cigar, once every five or so years. I'm familiar enough with the stuff as I'd like to be :)

    The one time I did accidentally vape e-juice with nicotine however, was after ordering several 0mg (nic-free) flavored juices, when I had a 24mg strength flavor mixed in with my shipment for free, by the supplier.

    I was sweating, heart racing, damp-palmed, had head rushes, very signature of nicotine use, and all long before I even looked at the bottle. I figured it was a very delayed, freak reaction from my morning coffee, except I had it hours earlier.

    Later on I read the bottle, and realized the reaction was due to the fact that I was putting large levels of nicotine into my system, for the first time in years. I vaped through over half a cart in a half an hour, thinking it 'wouldn't matter', because I thought it was additive (nicotine) free.

    No 0mg juice has ever given me the nic-twitches like that. I wouldn't be so certain of their delivery if I hadn't both experienced it myself, lived in Australia during their ban, and heard first hand from hundreds of patients who use e-cigs both for nicotine, and canna.
     
  18. How can you doubt they do deliver nicotine, if you do get relief with constant all day puffing?

    Again I object only to your false claim that electronic cigarettes are zero delivery devices, something your own observations refute. The level of use at which you are satisfied is entirely unrelated to the question: Do they, or do they not, deliver nicotine?

    I do enjoy vaping for its own sake, and sometimes vape 0mg-nicotine juice before bed. If I wake up and mistakenly use one of those cartridges instead of a nicotine one, I very quickly notice that I'm still craving. And no, I have not used dip, snuff, snus, chew, etc to aid my cessation, which has been successful for four months after seven years of PAD+ cigarette smoking.
     
  19. Windowless, that sounds exactly like I've heard from so many others who use e-cigs to curb nicotine cravings, according to many users it's absolutely noticable when you change from 0mg, to any (even the smallest) level or amount of nicotine. I know I noticed, lol. And congrats on your success :)

    Nicotine testing | Cotinine test | Drug test nicotine

    This is one method that people have used to test on their own, in the comfort of their own homes, whether or not e-cigs deliver nicotine.

    It's painfully simple to determin that they do, in fact, deliver nicotine :) People who use e-cigs alone, test positive for it.

    Anyone can test this for their own satisfaction, by using only e-cigs and avoiding other methods of nicotine delivery for up to or over a week.
    After 4 days, the presence of nicotine won't usually show on a simple home test, so a full week of avoiding tobacco product should be sufficient to get it out of your system, while regularly continuing e-cig use, were the e-cigs not contributing to the levels present.
     

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